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82xx/83xx differences

thinjointmortar, modified 7 Years ago.

82xx/83xx differences

Youngling Posts: 6 Join Date: 1/11/13 Recent Posts
Hi,

Are there any differences in between 82xx and 83xx series other than the size? At least they seem to have different GLM software and it also would make sense the new models to be named 8220/8230 if they were the same series. Trying to decide between used 8240 and the new 8330 (they'd cost almost the same, of course just guessing the pricing of 8330 here).

Also, is the GLM 2.0 gonna be included in the price of the 83xx monitors? Can the 83xx be calibrated with GLM 1.0?

Thanks for the info.
1038, modified 7 Years ago.

Re: 82xx/83xx differences

Jedi Master Posts: 340 Join Date: 4/6/09 Recent Posts
I'm not sure on the tech spec differences between the 8200 v 8300 but i do know that GLM 2.0 wont currently work with 8200 and not 100% sure but i believe that GLM 1.x wont work with 8300...
klaus, modified 7 Years ago.

Re: 82xx/83xx differences

Youngling Posts: 10 Join Date: 4/2/10 Recent Posts
Hi,

in my opinion the major differences of the 8320A & 8330A are a the new rear half-housings of the enclosure made of die-cast aluminum, the Class D amplification and supposed new DSP´s ("floating point digital signal processing engines")

Klaus
ilkka-rissanen, modified 7 Years ago.

Re: 82xx/83xx differences

Yoda Posts: 2564 Join Date: 3/23/09 Recent Posts
Hi,

Are there any differences in between 82xx and 83xx series other than the size? At least they seem to have different GLM software and it also would make sense the new models to be named 8220/8230 if they were the same series. Trying to decide between used 8240 and the new 8330 (they'd cost almost the same, of course just guessing the pricing of 8330 here).

8300 and 7300 series is a completely new design including signal processing, amplification, filter design etc. Also, we haven't had 8x20 or 8x30 sized DSP speakers before in our product range.


Also, is the GLM 2.0 gonna be included in the price of the 83xx monitors?

There will be a bundle pack of two speakers and the GLM kit which will be priced very attractively. :)


Can the 83xx be calibrated with GLM 1.0?

No. 8300 and 7300 series products require GLM 2.0 including the network adapter unit.

Current DSP series products (8200, 7200 and 1200 series) are fully supported in the GLM 2.0.
1038, modified 7 Years ago.

Re: 82xx/83xx differences

Jedi Master Posts: 340 Join Date: 4/6/09 Recent Posts
Great to hear about support for 8200 series and V2.0, it does contradict what i was told on Friday....

Will there be an expansion kit available in 2.0 for existing GLM 1.x owners who already have microphones?

Any news on when a MAC version will be available??
udayan, modified 7 Years ago.

Re: 82xx/83xx differences

Padawan Posts: 38 Join Date: 6/6/13 Recent Posts
Hello,

The 82xx series as well as 72xx are fully supported by GLM 2.0 ! Great news.

But what are the expected improvement for 82xx and 72xx series with GLM 2.0 over GLM 1.0 ?

Do we have more filters or new/better correction algorythm ?

Providing the fact that GLM 2.0 has to deal with the "old DSPs" of the 82xx and 72xx, is there any space for improvement and better correction ?



Cheers




Udayan
milofix, modified 7 Years ago.

Re: 82xx/83xx differences

Youngling Posts: 13 Join Date: 6/10/12 Recent Posts
Wonderful news!!! :P

Can you tell us in what price range the bundle with speakers and the glm Ilkka?
thinjointmortar, modified 7 Years ago.

Re: 82xx/83xx differences

Youngling Posts: 6 Join Date: 1/11/13 Recent Posts
Prices are
8320 + GLM // 1200EUR
8330 + GLM // 1700EUR

Wondering when will the shipping start? My wife also needs to know whether these will be available in white? :P
ilkka-rissanen, modified 7 Years ago.

Re: 82xx/83xx differences

Yoda Posts: 2564 Join Date: 3/23/09 Recent Posts
Compact SAM FAQ

Q: Are the current DSP series products (82xx, 12xx, 72xx) supported in the GLM 2.0?
A: Yes. GLM 2.0 software supports not only the new Compact SAM products (8320, 8330, and 7350) but also all other SAM products (8240, 8250, 8260, 1237A, 1238A, 1238AC, 1238CF, 7260, 7270, and 7271). All SAM products and Compact SAM products can be mixed into the same setup. However, we always recommend that two monitors constituting a stereo pair are of the same model and type. If possible, all monitors in a multimonitor system, such as a 5.1 system, should be of the same type. The compatibility requires that the GLM 2.0 User Kit is used. This User Kit contains the GLM 2.0 Adapter and GLM 2.0 Measurement Microphone. The SE system is not supported by GLM 2.0.

Q: Can the 83xx be calibrated with the GLM 1.0?
A: No. Compact SAM products (8320, 8330, and 7350) are only supported by GLM 2.0. This includes system calibration.

Q: What are the differences in between the 82xx and 83xx series products other than the size?
A: There are several improvements in the new 83xx products. The capability to adapt to the room acoustics has been improved greatly, and these products provide four to five times higher number of tools for room response compensation compared to the 82xx products. The delay alignment capability has been expanded from about 80 ms to about 200 ms in 83xx. 83xx have been time-equalized internally to have a constant input-to-output delay above 400 Hz. 83xx products can level align by 60 dB. All 83xx and 73xx products support distributed bass management, enabling the audio signal to be passed unmodified from the source and through the subwoofer into the monitors. 73xx subwoofers support a multichannel audio signal and stereo AES/EBU digital audio signal.

Q: When will you publish the pricing?
A: Pricing has been published. Please contact your local dealer/distributor for more information.

Q: Will the current 82xx products be phased out by respective upgraded models 8340, 8350 and 8360?
A: No. 82xx products continue in production.

Q: Does Genelec still continue to support the old GLM Software (e.g. Yosemite Upgrade, future OS Upgrades) and therefore users of the old unit can keep it running as long as they do not need the volume control?
A: GLM 1.5 supports Windows 7, 8, 8.1, and Apple Macintosh OS X 10.9 and 10.10 (update will be released later).

Q: Do the "old" calibration microphones fit to the new GLM units?
A: Yes.

Q: But what are the expected improvements for 82xx and 72xx series with GLM 2.0 over GLM 1.0 ? Do we have more filters or new/better correction algorithm? Providing the fact that GLM 2.0 has to deal with the "old DSPs" of the 82xx and 72xx, is there any space for improvement and better correction?
A: GLM 2.0 provides a smoother, better integrated user interface with fast setup time and more accurate calibration. A major improvement in the GLM 2.0 is the Group concept. GLM 2.0 supports five Groups inside one System Setup file. It is very easy and fast to move between groups. Each group contains its own input selection (analog, digital), system equalization and alignment, monitoring preset levels, and monitoring level. With the Groups concept the customer can implement extremely flexible monitoring arrangements that can flexibly switch between analog and digital audio signal sources and different sets of loudspeakers and monitoring purposes.

Q: Will there be an expansion kit available in 2.0 for existing GLM 1.x owners who already have microphones?
A: No. There is one standard GLM 2.0 User Kit. This kit contains the GLM 2.0 measurement microphone.

Q: Any news on when a MAC version will be available?
A: The Apple Macintosh version of GLM 2.0 software will be available in Q1 2015.

Q: Can I use the GLM 1 USB Adapter with the Compact SAM products?
A: No. Compact SAM products use the GLM 2.0 User Kit and this includes the 2.0 Adapter and Microphone.

Q: Can I buy Compact SAM products in different colours?
A: Yes. The 8320 and 8330 default colour is the dark grey (colour code P). The 8320 and 8330 are also available in white colour (colour code W). The 7350 subwoofer has one colour, and it is black.

Q: When does the Compact SAM products start shipping?
A: Shipping starts on October 1st.
wire, modified 7 Years ago.

Re: 82xx/83xx differences

Youngling Posts: 5 Join Date: 9/19/14 Recent Posts
8300 and 7300 series is a completely new design including signal processing, amplification, filter design etc.

Does this mean that the new series sound different compared to 8000 or 8200 series? Can we expect a brand new sound or even improved from the 8300 speakers?

The capability to adapt to the room acoustics has been improved greatly, and these products provide four to five times higher number of tools for room response compensation compared to the 82xx products. .

Sorry but I don’t get it. Since 8200 and 8300 share the same GLM 2.0 software how the new series adapt better in difficult rooms?

GLM 2.0 provides a smoother, better integrated user interface with fast setup time and more accurate calibration. A major improvement in the GLM 2.0 is the Group concept. GLM 2.0 supports five Groups inside one System Setup file. It is very easy and fast to move between groups.

In other words your correction algorithm is the same as GLM1.0? I haven’t heard your DSP correction algorithms so far but is it close to Lyngdorf’s roomperfect algorithm? Have you ever compare your DSP to Lyngdorf? http://lyngdorf.com/technologies/roomperfect
Finally I think in your GLM 1.0 you had only 4 or 5 filter points for correction, the new GLM 2.0 does it have more filters?
thinjointmortar, modified 7 Years ago.

Re: 82xx/83xx differences

Youngling Posts: 6 Join Date: 1/11/13 Recent Posts
Q: Any news on when a MAC version will be available?
A: The Apple Macintosh version of GLM 2.0 software will be available in Q1 2015.


That's a disappointment and a bit weird since an overwhelming majority of both home and professional studios use MACs.

I assume I can still buy 8330 + GLM 2.0 bundle now and then download the Mac version later free of charge, correct?
ilkka-rissanen, modified 7 Years ago.

Re: 82xx/83xx differences

Yoda Posts: 2564 Join Date: 3/23/09 Recent Posts

Does this mean that the new series sound different compared to 8000 or 8200 series? Can we expect a brand new sound or even improved from the 8300 speakers?

8320 and 8330 are completely new products. There isn't 8200 series products available in this size.


Sorry but I don’t get it. Since 8200 and 8300 share the same GLM 2.0 software how the new series adapt better in difficult rooms?

Correction is done by the DSP chip inside the speakers. 8300 have newer and better chips which allow better adaptation in difficult rooms.


In other words your correction algorithm is the same as GLM1.0? I haven’t heard your DSP correction algorithms so far but is it close to Lyngdorf’s roomperfect algorithm? Have you ever compare your DSP to Lyngdorf? http://lyngdorf.com/technologies/roomperfect
Finally I think in your GLM 1.0 you had only 4 or 5 filter points for correction, the new GLM 2.0 does it have more filters?

The GLM™ 2.0 Genelec Loudspeaker Manager is a highly intuitive and powerful monitor control networking system. Software features adjustment of levels, distance delays and flexible room response compensation equalization with the state-of-the-art and robust AutoCal™ automated calibration system. The capability to adapt to the room acoustics has been improved greatly, and these products provide four to five times higher number of tools for room response compensation compared to the 82xx products.
ilkka-rissanen, modified 7 Years ago.

Re: 82xx/83xx differences

Yoda Posts: 2564 Join Date: 3/23/09 Recent Posts

I assume I can still buy 8330 + GLM 2.0 bundle now and then download the Mac version later free of charge, correct?

Of course. Our software will be downloadable free of charge for anyone who likes to try it out, but the features are limited in demo mode. You need to have the network adapter, microphone and of course SAM series speakers to unlock full features.
udayan, modified 7 Years ago.

Re: 82xx/83xx differences

Padawan Posts: 38 Join Date: 6/6/13 Recent Posts
Hi,

Let me translate in other words, what I understand from what is not clearly stated.

For the 82XX series, GLM 2.0 brings only a revamped user interface because the DSP chips of the 82xx series are outdated and not able to take advantages of the increased number of notch filters. The descending compatibility of the GLM 2.0 allows users to mix 82xx and 83xx series (in an HC setup for instance). But for those who have only 82xx/72xx speakers, keep the good old GLM 1.0 software because there is no sound improvement to expect from the software upgrade.



Cheers



Udayan
bourne, modified 7 Years ago.

Re: 82xx/83xx differences

Padawan Posts: 74 Join Date: 2/26/14 Recent Posts
The thread is named 82xx/83xx differences, still: the 1237/1238 have been released just weeks ago - do they already have more powerful DSPs compared to the 82xx and will therefore benefit from the new GML unit/software?
wire, modified 7 Years ago.

Re: 82xx/83xx differences

Youngling Posts: 5 Join Date: 9/19/14 Recent Posts
8320 and 8330 are completely new products. There isn't 8200 series products available in this size.

OK, but besides the smaller size of the cabinets and drivers and due to the new design, signal processing, amplification, filter design etc, does the 8300 series sound different compared to 8200 or even improved?

The GLM™ 2.0 Genelec Loudspeaker Manager is a highly intuitive and powerful monitor control networking system. Software features adjustment of levels, distance delays and flexible room response compensation equalization with the state-of-the-art and robust AutoCal™ automated calibration system. The capability to adapt to the room acoustics has been improved greatly, and these products provide four to five times higher number of tools for room response compensation compared to the 82xx products.

Still you didn’t answer my question... the GLM2.0 algorithm is the same as GLM 1.0? How many filter points has the GLM 2.0? I think GLM 1.0 had about 5 filters. Finally, have you ever compare your DSP to Lyngdorf room perfect? http://lyngdorf.com/technologies/roomperfect
1038, modified 7 Years ago.

Re: 82xx/83xx differences

Jedi Master Posts: 340 Join Date: 4/6/09 Recent Posts
Hi Ilkka,

Can you tell me if there is any ISS implementation on the new 8300/7300 series?
ilkka-rissanen, modified 7 Years ago.

Re: 82xx/83xx differences

Yoda Posts: 2564 Join Date: 3/23/09 Recent Posts
Hi Ilkka,

Can you tell me if there is any ISS implementation on the new 8300/7300 series?

Hi Steve,

Naturally ISS is implemented on all models. Since it's fully configurable through GLM, one can adjust its settings quite freely.
udayan, modified 7 Years ago.

Re: 82xx/83xx differences

Padawan Posts: 38 Join Date: 6/6/13 Recent Posts
Hi Ilkka,

As you are currently on line, could you please confirm that there is no sound improvement with GLM 2.0 for 82xx/72xx series



Cheers




Udayan
ilkka-rissanen, modified 7 Years ago.

Re: 82xx/83xx differences

Yoda Posts: 2564 Join Date: 3/23/09 Recent Posts
Hi Ilkka,

As you are currently on line, could you please confirm that there is no sound improvement with GLM 2.0 for 82xx/72xx series

Cheers
Udayan

Hi Udayan,

Correct, GLM 2.0 offers software/GUI improvements for 1200/8200/7200 series speakers.
udayan, modified 7 Years ago.

Re: 82xx/83xx differences

Padawan Posts: 38 Join Date: 6/6/13 Recent Posts
Thank you Ilkka



All the best



Udayan
tesla, modified 7 Years ago.

Re: 82xx/83xx differences

Youngling Posts: 16 Join Date: 11/18/09 Recent Posts
Deleted
wire, modified 7 Years ago.

Re: 82xx/83xx differences

Youngling Posts: 5 Join Date: 9/19/14 Recent Posts
8320 and 8330 are completely new products. There isn't 8200 series products available in this size.

OK, but besides the smaller size of the cabinets and drivers and due to the new design, signal processing, amplification, filter design etc, does the 8300 series sound different compared to 8200 or even improved?

The GLM™ 2.0 Genelec Loudspeaker Manager is a highly intuitive and powerful monitor control networking system. Software features adjustment of levels, distance delays and flexible room response compensation equalization with the state-of-the-art and robust AutoCal™ automated calibration system. The capability to adapt to the room acoustics has been improved greatly, and these products provide four to five times higher number of tools for room response compensation compared to the 82xx products.

Still you didn’t answer my question... the GLM2.0 algorithm is the same as GLM 1.0? How many filter points has the GLM 2.0? I think GLM 1.0 had about 5 filters. Finally, have you ever compare your DSP to Lyngdorf room perfect? http://lyngdorf.com/technologies/roomperfect
ilkka-rissanen, modified 7 Years ago.

Re: 82xx/83xx differences

Yoda Posts: 2564 Join Date: 3/23/09 Recent Posts

OK, but besides the smaller size of the cabinets and drivers and due to the new design, signal processing, amplification, filter design etc, does the 8300 series sound different compared to 8200 or even improved?

I believe I already answered to your question. There is no direct comparison available between those series because there is no 8220 or 8230 available. Naturally 8300 series products provide a huge improvement compared to analogue models 8020 and 8030.


Still you didn’t answer my question... the GLM2.0 algorithm is the same as GLM 1.0? How many filter points has the GLM 2.0? I think GLM 1.0 had about 5 filters. Finally, have you ever compare your DSP to Lyngdorf room perfect? http://lyngdorf.com/technologies/roomperfect

I believe I already answered to your question. "The capability to adapt to the room acoustics has been improved greatly, and these products provide four to five times higher number of tools for room response compensation compared to the 82xx products."

Other information is confidential and unfortunately I am not able to disclose it with you, thank you.
wire, modified 7 Years ago.

Re: 82xx/83xx differences

Youngling Posts: 5 Join Date: 9/19/14 Recent Posts
There is no direct comparison available between those series because there is no 8220 or 8230 available. Naturally 8300 series products provide a huge improvement compared to analogue models 8020 and 8030.

I read somewhere in your previous answers that you won’t upgrade 8240, 8250, 8260 to 8340, 8350, 8360 respectively. If the new 8300 is a “huge improvement” as you wrote, why not upgrading and improve the older models?
ilkka-rissanen, modified 7 Years ago.

Re: 82xx/83xx differences

Yoda Posts: 2564 Join Date: 3/23/09 Recent Posts
Hi,

"...huge improvement compared to analogue models 8020 and 8030."
udayan, modified 7 Years ago.

Re: 82xx/83xx differences

Padawan Posts: 38 Join Date: 6/6/13 Recent Posts
Hi,

Maybe it is because bigger models do not need the increased number of notch filters to achieve a good frequency response ??? !!! ...

The smaller the speaker the harder to get a good response.


Or maybe it is because the counterpart of the new DSP in terms of phase rotation is higher than the response linearity gain for 82xx series ??? !!! ...




Cheers,





Udayan
joerggermany, modified 7 Years ago.

Re: 82xx/83xx differences

Padawan Posts: 36 Join Date: 12/23/13 Recent Posts
...
Finally, have you ever compare your DSP to Lyngdorf room perfect? http://lyngdorf.com/technologies/roomperfect


Hi, i own a Lyngdorf DPA1. In my opinion GLM 1.0 is better then Lyngdorfs Roomcorrection.
Lyngdorfs correction ist a little bit flatter, but Impulseresponse ist softer.

Gruß Joerg
wire, modified 7 Years ago.

Re: 82xx/83xx differences

Youngling Posts: 5 Join Date: 9/19/14 Recent Posts
Hi, i own a Lyngdorf DPA1. In my opinion GLM 1.0 is better then Lyngdorfs Roomcorrection.
Lyngdorfs correction ist a little bit flatter, but Impulseresponse ist softer.

Thanks for letting me know! I’ve checked in a friend’s studio KRK Ergo along Focal Focal CMS65 and Ergo was really working! Ego has borrowed the algorithm from Lyngdorfs Roomcorrection but in a limited frequency range, 20 to 500Hz if I remember correctly.
I think Lyngdorfs roomcorrection is using thousands of filters for the whole spectrum 20 to 20.000Hz and I thought it was the best DSP on the market, but since you've test it, it’s really good to know that Genelec’s DSP is working better!
joerggermany, modified 7 Years ago.

Re: 82xx/83xx differences

Padawan Posts: 36 Join Date: 12/23/13 Recent Posts
hi wire,
i don't think Lyngdorf ist Best. In my opinion the Trinnov Analyser is the best
roomcorrection you can get. But they are all very close. For me the Ranking is:

1) Trinnov
2) GLM
2,5) Lyngdorf/KRK
3) Anti-Mode 2.0

One Word to the Trinnov. If you use the full potential of its Fir-Filters and Phase correction,
you have easyly a delay of > 200 ms. All others use IIR-Filters with a delay < 5 ms. so you can't
use the Trinnov in a mixed Hifi/HomeCinema Configuration wit it's full potential. So if you have
82../83.. Models you don't need an other Roomprocessor and if you want to buy new Loudspeakers
then buy the versions with GLM. They are worth the money.

For me the Trinnov, even with full filtering, it's not worth the extra money, over the GLM.

Gruss Joerg
imrecs, modified 6 Years ago.

Re: 82xx/83xx differences

Youngling Posts: 14 Join Date: 12/6/14 Recent Posts
Will there be larger 8340/8350 series coming out in the near future? If I buy 8240s will I see an update to 8340s soon and regret? Thanks
ilkka-rissanen, modified 6 Years ago.

Re: 82xx/83xx differences

Yoda Posts: 2564 Join Date: 3/23/09 Recent Posts
Will there be larger 8340/8350 series coming out in the near future? If I buy 8240s will I see an update to 8340s soon and regret? Thanks

I understand your problem but unfortunately I am not able to disclose any information about our future product launches. Our product range will be updated continuously and we will inform about the new products when they are ready to launch. :)